Used Bending Machines for sale (65,187)

Condition: new, Year of construction: 2025, control type: NC control, actuation type: hydraulic, power: 4 kW (5.44 HP), STANDARD EQUIPMENT Welded steel construction body Three-rolls driven by motors Hardened and ground shafts made from special high-strength material Horizontal and vertical working positions Hardened standard rolls Movable control panel separate from machine body Three-way adjustable mechanical manual side supports Precise bending with braked motor Digital displays (2 units) OPTIONAL EQUIPMENT Rolls for pipe and profile bending Optional two-axis hydraulic side supports Automation with NC control Dkodpfxew Smhws Ac Njh TECHNICAL SPECIFICATIONS Upper Shaft Diameter: 60 mm Lower Shaft Construction: 50 mm Roll Diameter: 180 mm Working Speed: 6 m/min Motor Power: 3.75 kW Length: 1200 mm Width: 850 mm Height: 1200 mm Weight: 955 kg

Condition: new, Year of construction: 2025, control type: NC control, actuation type: hydraulic, number of rollers: 3, roller (bottom) diameter: 250 mm, roller (top) diameter: 250 mm, side roll diameter: 200 mm, roller length: 3,100 mm, sheet thickness (max.): 9 mm, overall weight: 5,400 kg, STANDARD EQUIPMENT Steel construction main frames Hydraulic upper roll opening head Movable control panel Motor-driven central rolls Hydraulic up/down movement for rear and bottom rolls Precision bending with braked main motor Cone bending and pre-bending system Upper and bottom rolls driven by planetary gearbox Rear roll ball support system for easier sheet movement Compliance with EU safety directives High-strength, forged steel rolls manufactured from SAE 1050 (CK45) certified steel Hardened shafts Dsdpfx Ajw Slbvec Nokh Digital readouts (2 units) Operator's manual OPTIONAL EQUIPMENT Overhead crane (elevator) for support in large diameter bending Hydraulic side supports for support in large diameter bending Ground and polished rolls Wire grooves on roll ends NC control unit Dual-speed operation Infinitely variable speed adjustment Ejector system Hydraulic motor option TECHNICAL DATA Bending Length: 3050 mm Pre-bending: 5/7 mm Bending: 7/9 mm Top & Bottom Roll Diameter: 250 mm Side Roll Diameter: 200 mm Min. Bending Diameter: 375 / 1250 mm Motor Power: 7.5 + 1.5 kW Bending Speed: 5 m/min Tank Capacity: 25 L Length: 5000 mm Width: 1200 mm Height: 1370 mm Weight: 5400 kg

Condition: excellent (used), Year of construction: 2006, Ercolina CML TB-76 Pipe Bender Excellent condition Year 2006 Foot Pedal Dsdpfsu H Ibnex Ac Njkh Weight 193kg Power supply - 415v/3 phase

Condition: like new (used), functionality: fully functional, Year of construction: 2019, operating hours: 250 h, machine/vehicle number: 0131, control type: NC control, degree of automation: semi-automatic, actuation type: hydraulic, pipe diameter (max.): 48 mm, pipe length (max.): 3,000 mm, tube wall thickness (max.): 4 mm, bending angle (max.): 180 °, overall weight: 670 kg, input voltage: 400 V, input frequency: 50 Hz, number of digital displays: 1, Equipment: CE marking, centralized greasing system, documentation/manual, emergency stop, T U B O M A T – simply smart. TUB-C G3001 The tube bending machine is ideally suited for single parts and small series production. The software allows individual tubes to be parameterized, simulated, and saved. Bending data is then transmitted to the machine via network (LAN). Standard bending equipment - Electronic Siemens SIMATIC control system - Function selection and operation via 4.3-inch touch panel - Familiar 4-fold preselection of bending angles or program mode - 80 memory locations for up to 10 sets - Actual/target value display for bending angles - Compact, forward-positioned bending head - Optimized tooling concept - Hydraulic bending drive, operated via proven hand lever - Hydraulic tube clamping - Hydraulic pressure die actuation - Hydraulic mandrel extraction - Mobile use possible - Saw unit for optimal right-angle cuts - Deburring unit for internal and external deburring - Universal base holder as drive unit for assembly attachments Technical Data - Tube capacity up to: 48.3 x 3.25 mm (E235, Rm = 2 x D) - Bending radius up to: 125 mm - Control: electronic Dkedpfx Acjx E Rdwj Njh - Max. bending angle: 180° (+10° overbend) - Bending accuracy: ±0.2° - Bending speed: 20°/s - Dimensions L/W/H: 3880 / 800 / 1250 mm - Weight: approx. 700 kg - Power: 2.4 kW - Electrical connection: 400 V / 50 Hz / 3 phase - Power supply requirements: CEE 16 A - Colour: RAL 9006 / 7021 / 5015 Software (Windows 11) PIPEFAB 4.0 BE Basic tube bending software package - Oracle Express database for single-user application - Creation of isometries (single tube) - ConCSVImp – import interface for CSV format - Calculation of bending data taking springback, elongation, and spring-in into account - Checking of clamping lengths, start and end lengths - Output of bending data (printout) - BendSim – bending simulation and graphical representation via parametric tool design - BendCon – creation and transfer of NC bending data for TUBOMAT - Data transfer via LAN Tool holders 1 set of adapters for bending rollers with 25 mm bore 1 clamping piece adapter installation space 100 mm 1 support for fixed pressure die installation space 100 mm Tools Bending tools consisting of bending roller, clamping piece, and pressure die (fixed) Tube diameters / Bending radii - Ø8.0 mm R=20 mm - Ø10.0 mm R=20.5 mm - Ø12.0 mm R=24.0 mm - Ø15.0 mm R=30.0 mm - Ø16.0 mm R=32.0 mm - Ø18.0 mm R=36.0 mm - Ø20.0 mm R=40.0 mm - Ø22.0 mm R=44.0 mm Mandrels 3000 mm for steel tubes Design with lubrication channel for minimal quantity lubrication (MQL) - 18.0 mm x wall thickness - 20.0 mm x wall thickness - 22.0 mm x wall thickness Pre-assembly studs for cutting ring fittings (L = light, S = heavy design) Tube Ø - 6 mm L - 6 mm S - 8 mm L - 8 mm S - 10 mm L - 10 mm S - 12 mm L - 12 mm S - 15 mm - 16 mm - 18 mm - 20 mm - 22 mm Back-up plates for cutting ring pre-assembly with automatic pressure adjustment for steel and stainless steel tubes Tube Ø - 6 mm L + S - 8 mm L + S - 10 mm L + S - 12 mm L + S - 15 mm - 16 mm - 18 mm - 20 mm - 22 mm Other tube diameters and wall thicknesses possible. The machine is used but in like-new condition. The machine can be inspected and demonstrated by prior arrangement. The machine must be collected from our premises but can be loaded by us. Commercial sale. Price plus 19% VAT. Subject to prior sale and errors.

Condition: new, Ring profile bending machine Ostas OPK 42 Incl. standard roller set steel Motorized ring bending machine horizontal and vertical applicable with 2 driven rolls lower rolls motor driven rollers are hardened manual feed via upper roller left/right rotation by means of foot pedal shaft-Ø 50 mm roller-Ø top 158 mm roller-Ø bottom 158 mm speed 4,4 m/min Motor power 0,75 kW Electrical connection 400 V According to CE standard Dkedpfegw Hmqsx Ac Neh Weight 380 kg According to CE standard

Condition: used, Swivel bending machine KRAMER type A-Maut. II 1000 No. 48 287 Year of construction 1990 effective length 1060 mm max. sheet thickness 3.75 mm Stroke of upper beam 180 mm Adjustability of the folding beam 60 mm Backgauge 480 mm Drive power of folding beam drive 4 kW Drive power upper beam drive 1.5 kW Mains connection 400 Volt, 50 Hz - Manual and semi-automatic control - Angle adjustment via angle preselection disk - one-piece pointing rail 135° - backgauge with hand crank adjustment and simple measuring scale - Continuous fence rail - Electric foot switch, 3-position Space requirement L x W x H 2200 x 1350 x 1500 mm Weight approx. 2.3 tons Dkodpfx Ajfnabyjc Neh good condition

Condition: used, Year of construction: 2009, Brand: PBT Indumasch Type: 25 PC 300 Steering system: PC-300 Year of construction: 2009 Torq each roll 1600 Nm Front roll 1000 mm adjustable Power 3 kW Roll height 300 mm Auflosung und positionierung X-Achse 1/100 mm New SIEMENS TOUCH PANEL Specifications Metric US Standard Djdpsu R Rvcsfx Ac Nekh Horizontal and vertical Horizontal Axis Ø 105 mm Number of rollers 3 Stroke X-axis 265 mm Capacity flat 120 x 15 x R = 2000 mm Capacity tube 114 x R = 2000 mm Ø x mm Capacity solid 60 x 60 x R = 1000 mm Dimensions (Estimate) Length 1500 mm Width 1200 mm Height 1500 mm Weight 1350 kg Important: The information on this page has been obtained to the best of our ability and belief and where necessary obtained from the manufacturers.b Accuracy cannot be guaranteed but the information is given in good faith. Accordingly, it does not constitute a representation or contractual terms. We encourage you to check all essential details!

Condition: excellent (used), Year of construction: 2001, sheet width 3100 mm plate thickness 6.0 mm ST pre-bending 4.0 mm ST diameter of upper rolls 200 mm side roll diameter 165 mm diameter of lower rolls 190 mm bending speed ca. 5.0 m/min Control DIGI oil volume 80.0 Liter voltage 380 V total power requirement 6.0 kW weight 6000 kg range L-W-H 5250 x 1500 x 1400 mm very good condition (!!) Dodpfsx Sr Dfsx Ac Nekh Current new price approx. 80,000 euros Special price on request Features: - Robust electro-hydraulic 4-roll bending machine * 4-roll concept offers a wide range of bending and rounding options - MG swivel control panel * Operation - control of all rolls and machine axes * Digital position display * Manual operation via joysticks - Two central rolls are driven directly by hydraulic motors - Conical rolling possible via inclined position of the rolls - Parallelism of the side rollers via torsion shafts - Bending on both sides - Diameters of up to 1.1 times the upper roller diameter are possible - Forged and hardened rollers with a strength of 53-55 HRC - Low-maintenance, stable machine concept - Permanent lubrication of all bearings - Stable steel welded construction - Electro-hydraulic folding bearing for easy pipe removal - Pressure gauge/pressure display for the rollers - Safety device (safety line with switch unit) - Operating instructions (PDF)

Condition: new, functionality: fully functional, Year of construction: 2026, control type: CNC control, degree of automation: automatic, actuation type: electric, controller manufacturer: Siemens, roller (bottom) diameter: 160 mm, roller (top) diameter: 175 mm, side roll diameter: 135 mm, roller length: 1,550 mm, working width: 1,500 mm, sheet thickness (max.): 7 mm, power: 4.4 kW (5.98 HP), input voltage: 400 V, input frequency: 50 Hz, warranty duration: 12 months, Equipment: centralized greasing system, cone bending device, documentation/manual, hardened rollers, swiveling upper roller, Electronically Controlled, Electrohydraulic Four-Roller Plate Bending Machine Manufacturer: FACCIN, Model 4 EDL 1617 Technical Specifications: Number of rollers: Four Geometry of side rollers: Linear guides Working width: 1500 mm Top roller diameter: 175 mm Bottom roller diameter: 160 mm Side roller diameter: 135 mm Pressing force against top roller: 80 tons Guaranteed installed power: 4.4 kW (6 HP) Djdpfx Aewwt Ddjc Nokh Guaranteed maximum rotation speed: 0–10 m/min Guaranteed machine weight: 3,150 kg Length: 3,300 mm Width: 1,170 mm Height: 1,100 mm Guaranteed Performance: For material with yield strength 260 N/mm² Rolling capacity (full working width): 7 mm Pre-bending capacity (full working width): 6 mm From pipe diameter: 875 mm Rolling capacity (full working width): 5 mm Pre-bending capacity (full working width): 5 mm From pipe diameter: 225 mm Standard Equipment: Double linear guide system for roller movement Extremely wide bearing blocks MCS double bearing system for roller rotation Extra heavy-duty, double-support swing bearing Electronic Parallelism System EPS Hardened rollers for high wear resistance All rollers ground after heat treatment Siemens PLC control system Electric drive for top roller for increased efficiency Safety trip wire with emergency stop and CE certification Centralized lubrication Cone bending device Optional Equipment Included: CNC control PGS-ABSOLUTE

Condition: new, functionality: fully functional, Year of construction: 2026, HAV 3293 Plate width: 3200mm Top Roll diameter: 930mm Side rolls diameter: mm 800 Machine weight: 150 Ton Rolling capacities (Y:260Mpa/Ø 4650mm): 3200mmx155mm Prebending capacities (Y:260Mpa/Ø 4650mm): 3200mmx115mm Dkedpfx Ajiivg Sjc Noh

Condition: new, functionality: fully functional, Year of construction: 2026, TECHNICAL SPECIFICATIONS: Number of rolls FOUR Geometry linear guides Maximum plate width mm 3000 Top roll diameter mm 390 Bottom roll diameter mm 370 Side rolls diameter mm 295 Installed power HP 40 Stepless variable rotation movement m/1' 4-8 Machine weight (guaranteed) Kg 19,000 Guaranteed performance with material yield point 260 N/mm² Rolling capacity (full working width) Ø 1950 mm 25 mm Bending performance (full working width) Ø 1950 mm 20 mm Dkjdpogd T R Dofx Ac Noh Rolling capacity (full working width) Ø 507 mm 18 mm Bending performance (full working width) Ø 507 mm 16 mm • Hardened and polished rollers • Siemens NC control • Cone bending device with electronic tilting

Condition: new, functionality: fully functional, Year of construction: 2026, New three rolls angle roll Roundo R3 with tools, digital readout and remote control. Dsdpfx Acod N Ahdj Nokh

Condition: new, functionality: fully functional, Year of construction: 2026, Electronically controlled, hydraulic four-roller bending machine Make FACCIN, model 4 HEL/S 2122 Technical specifications: Number of Reels: Four Geometry of the side rollers: linear guides Working width: 2000 mm Top roller diameter: 225 mm Lower roller diameter: 215 mm Side roller diameter: 165 mm Pressure force against the top roller: 100 tons Guaranteed installed power: 9.2 kW (12.5 hp) Guaranteed maximum turning speed: 4-8 m/min Guaranteed machine weight: 4,450 kg Length: 3,500mm Width: 1,200mm Height: 1,100mm Dedpfxsd Eqg Hj Ac Nokh Guaranteed capacities: for material with a yield point of 260 N/mm² Rolling capacity (full working width) 11 mm Bending capacity (full working width) 8 mm from a pipe diameter of 1,100 mm Rolling capacity (full working width) 8 mm Bending performance (full working width) 6 mm from pipe diameter 286 mm Standard equipment: Double linear guide system for roller movement Extremely wide bearing blocks MCS double bearing system for the roller rotation Extra heavy double hinged folding bearing Electronic parallelism system EPS Hardened rollers for high wear protection All rolls ground after heat treatment Siemens S7 PLC control Hitech hydraulic and electric package Safety trip wire with emergency stop and CE certification central lubrication cone bending device Optional equipment included: CNC control PGS-ABSOLUTE

Condition: new, functionality: fully functional, Year of construction: 2026, Hydraulic two-roller bending machine Guaranteed capacities: Sheet thickness Bending with material 260 N/mm² Yield point: 2 mm Sheet thickness bending with material AISI 304-316 stainless steel: 1.5 mm Cycle time per part: 15 seconds Technical specifications: Working length: 1000 mm Installed power: 5.5 kW Rolling speed: 7 m/min Dkedpfx Aec S N Riec Noh immediately available from the factory!

Condition: new, functionality: fully functional, Year of construction: 2026, Three rolls variable axis bending roll Make FACCIN, model HAV/S 3145 Dodpfxec S N Nqo Ac Nskh Technical specifications: Number of Reels: Three Geometry of the side rollers: variable Working width: 3000 mm Top roller diameter: 450 mm variable three-roller bending machine

Condition: new, functionality: fully functional, Year of construction: 2026, Hydraulically controlled three-roller bending machine Make BIKO, model B3 2021 Technical specifications: Number of Reels: Three Geometry of the side rollers: linear guides Working width: 2000 mm Top roller diameter: 215 mm Side roller diameter: 195 mm Guaranteed installed power: 7.2 kW Guaranteed maximum rotation speed: 5 m/min Guaranteed machine weight: 3,000 kg Length: 3,700 mm Width: 1,000mm Height: 1,100 mm Guaranteed capacities: for material with a yield point of 260 N/mm² Rolling capacity (full working width) 13 mm Bending capacity (full working width) 9 mm from pipe diameter 1075 mm Rolling capacity (full working width) 9 mm Bending performance (full working width) 7 mm from pipe diameter 280 mm Standard equipment: Double linear guide system for the roller movement Extremely wide bearing blocks MCS double bearing system for the roller rotation Extra heavy double hinged release Hardened rolls for high wear protection Dksdpecuxp Tsfx Ac Noh Hydraulic parallelism system of the side rolls Digital display for the position of the side rolls cone bending device Safety trip wire with emergency stop and CE certification Mobile control panel

Condition: new, functionality: fully functional, Year of construction: 2026, Mechanical asymmetrical three-roller bending machine with pre-bending Make FACCIN, model ASI 2015 Dkedpfjcuxpqjx Ac Neh Guaranteed services: Sheet thickness rolls at 750 mm diameter 5 mm Sheet thickness bending at 750 mm diameter 4 mm Sheet thickness rollers with 195 mm diameter 4 mm Sheet thickness bending at 195 mm diameter 3 mm Performance data refer to steel with a yield point of 240 N/mm² and a strength of 370 N/mm² Technical specifications: Working length 2,000 mm Top roller diameter 150 mm Bottom roller diameter 150 mm Side roller diameter 150 mm Installed power 4.3 kW rolling speed 4 m/min Length 3,300 mm Width 750mm Height 1,200 mm Weight 2,136 kg Standard equipment: All rolls forged and inductively hardened Both central rollers driven Safety control with immediate stop of all machine movements Machine stand stands on frame carrier made of welded construction. This ensures optimum stability and reliability of the machine. Optimum power transmission in the machine stand through long guides with straight-line positioning movement of the bending rollers. (No curved adjustment movement and therefore no torsional forces in the machine stand) Digital display for the position display of the side roll motorized adjustment of the side roll brake motor for rotation and side roll movement Cone bending device with hardened stop block Emergency stop trip wire around the machine Machine with CE certification and documentation

Condition: good (used), functionality: fully functional, Year of construction: 2011, operating hours: 34,797 h, machine/vehicle number: 2011-0250, pipe diameter (max.): 600 mm, pipe length (max.): 1,500 mm, bending angle (max.): 180 °, bending radius (max.): 200 mm, wall thickness: 3 mm, Original machine year: 1996. In 2011, fully overhauled by the manufacturer for approx. EUR 250,000: electrical and mechanical components extensively renewed. TECHNICAL DETAILS Tube diameter: 16 – 60 mm Wall thickness: max. 3.0 mm Bending radius: 20 – 200 mm Tube feed length: 1,500 mm Bending angle: max. 180° + spring-back Tube length: 400 – 1,500 mm Tube outside diameter: 28 mm – 60 mm Material specifications Tensile strength stainless steel: max. 750 N/mm² Tensile strength mild steel: max. 450 N/mm² Capacity (steel): Ø 60 x 3 mm Capacity (stainless steel): Ø 57 x 2 mm Axes/Movements Bending direction: left Bending speed (forward): max. 22.0 rpm (infinitely variable) Bending speed (return): constant 22.0 rpm Rotational positioning: max. 360° Rotational speed: 50 rpm Multi-radius height adjustment: lowest tube center 55 mm Height travel: suitable for 3-groove bending tools MACHINE DETAILS Overrun time: 125 ms Machine weight: approx. 8.0 t Machine dimensions (L × W × H): 6,300 × 3,300 × 1,900 mm Control cabinet (L × W × H): 2,700 × 700 × 2,000 mm Control console (L × W × H): 900 × 600 × 1,850 mm Tube magazine (L × W × H): 1,800 × 2,400 × 1,750 mm Operating hours: approx. 34,797 h Dsdpfxjx Srkls Ac Nskh Performance data Total power requirement: 55 kW Hydraulic oil volume: 340 l Control Bending planes: up to 6 (CNC programmable) Positioning device: NTB configuration Control unit: Schwarze-Robitec operation and control console FEATURES - Automatic cold tube bending machine - Tube positioning device - Gripper - Schwarze-Robitec tube magazine - Hydraulic operation for bending table, tool clamping, sliding rail, mandrel retraction, reinforced sliding rail feed and retraction - Various bending tools for Ø 60 mm tubes - Various accessories - Control cabinet cooling unit - Dual foot switch - Schwarze-Robitec control console - Rittal control cabinet cooling unit, type SK 3361100 Note: Machine could only be tested in setup mode due to lack of operating know-how. No faults are known. The machine is currently disassembled.

Condition: new, shaft diameter: 30 mm, - Shaft diameter 30 mm - Turns to the right and left - Emergency stop - Documentation - 230V Dkjdohvv Hqjpfx Ac Nsh

Condition: new, shaft diameter: 80 mm, - Ring bending machine - Shaft diameter 80 mm - Lower two rollers are moved hydraulically - Three rollers driven - Hydraulically adjustable guide rollers - 2 digital displays - Brake motor - Can be used horizontally/vertically - Mobile control panel - Emergency stop - Documentation - 400V Dkodpfxjg Sr I Us Ac Noh

Condition: used, functionality: fully functional, Year of construction: 2012, operating hours: 500 h, control type: PLC-controlled, degree of automation: automatic, pipe length (max.): 3,000 mm, tube wall thickness (max.): 2 mm, Metalworking company sell megabender 030 In the equipment have mandrels for tube: 60,3mm x 2mm 50mm x 2mm 40mm x 2mm 700 kg - Powerful mandrel bending machine up to 2 "gas pipe (60.3mm) in semi-automatic design (3000 mm pipe slide length) - Electromechanical drive of the bending axis - hydraulic clamping - mandrel feed / extract - 30 programs x 9 bending angle + correction angle Dedpfx Acev Di Dns Njkh Stainless steel 2mm steel 3mm cooper and aluminium up to 4mm

Condition: good (used), Year of construction: 1992, functionality: fully functional, machine/vehicle number: 24550616, overall weight: 7,000 kg, total height: 1,900 mm, total length: 3,000 mm, total width: 3,000 mm, table width: 1,200 mm, table length: 2,450 mm, AMADA ARIES 245 CNC Punching Machine - Punching force: 200 kN - Power connection: 11 kVA Dodpfx Aoxw Tt Njc Nekh - Includes accessories such as various punches and punching tools Attention: The item must be collected definitively between 19 and 23 January 2026 on a specific date to be mutually agreed. FCA D-76571 Gaggenau – loaded onto truck

Condition: used, Year of construction: 2025, total length: 1,300 mm, total height: 1,400 mm, total width: 800 mm, Empty weight: 800 kg Price: On request - Year: 2025 - Documentation available: Yes - CE marking present: Yes - CE certificate present: Yes - Serial number: HB10011N2025006 - Operating hours: 0 - Motor power: 4.0kW - Table width: 550mm - Table length: 300mm - Model: Hydraulic - Max. stroke: 180mm - Power: 28.0ton - Transport dimensions: 1300mm x 800mm x 1400mm (l x w x h) - Transport weight [kg]: 800kg - Transport packages [pcs.]: 1 Financial information Dkedpexixrujfx Ac Neh VAT: The price shown is exclusive of VAT VAT/margin: VAT deductible for entrepreneurs Delivery and trade-in always possible for everything in the industrial sectors Lukas van Rossum

Condition: used, Year of construction: 2014, tube diameter 60 mm wall strength 3 mm bending radius min. 2 x Rohr-Ø ÷ R200 mm Dsdpfx Acoivqrbs Njkh 0 - 180 ° 2" (60.,3mm) mm stufenlos 0,5 - 2,0 1,5 kW 700 kg - Powerful mandrel bending machine up to 2 "gas pipe (60.3mm) in semi-automatic design (6000 mm pipe slide length) - Electromechanical drive of the bending axis - hydraulic clamping - mandrel feed / extract - 30 programs x 9 bending angle + correction angle

Condition: like new (used), Year of construction: 2019, tube diameter 28 mm wall strength 2 mm bending radius min. 90 mm control 3D TubeSoft Slim total power requirement 3,5 kW Description: Round tube steel (S235): 60.0 x 6.0 mm Round tube stainless steel (S 355): 60.0 x 4.0 mm Square tube steel: 50 x 50 x 4.0 mm Rectangular tube steel: 60 x 40 x 2.0 mm max. usable length: 3048 mm Bending speed: 10°/sec Dodpfx Acjxcuhls Nekh including tools (see photos) Mandrel is no longer available, can be retrofitted